Few times has the wild west looked (and sounded) this grand.
Words by Luis (@HeaviestOfArt):
Just prior to the weekend, Las Vegas delivered big in the form of Helldorado — the third and thrilling new album by the forward-thinking Spiritworld. Helmed by mastermind Stu Folsom and visualized by artist extraordinaire James Bousema (Kerry King, Municipal Waste), Helldorado stands tall as a journey navigating all ends of the metal, punk, Western, and hardcore arenas, never settling on linear conventions and instead expanding on its compositional variety from one track to the next. It's a wild ride and Bousema, who now illustrates his second consecutive Spiritworld cover, excels at capturing the scale and imposing will of the instrumentation packed within. Helldorado is an audiovisual triumph possible only by a strong camaraderie of the caliber of Folsom and Bousema — two Vegas natives with eyes set on pleasing their creative ambitions above all else.
Explore the duo's collaboration in an extensive Q&A we put together in conversation during the lead-up to Helldorado's grand release:
James and Stu, as Vegas natives, your partnership just makes sense and here we are with "Helldorado" — the second album you've worked on together and a massive undertaking on all ends. Obviously, you struck a strong creative chord, as we can see in the results. What began with "Deathwestern" has now expanded as a new part of a world of its own. Going back to the origin of it all, what can you share about how it's evolved to this point in "Helldorado"?
James: Stu, you can talk more about this, but I think you first reached out to me shortly after the 2022 Decibel Tour that you had with the Municipal Waste boys.
Stu: Yeah, that was our first tour as a band and I believe it was before "Electrified Brain" had come out. I may be wrong, but regardless, you drew this fucking metalhead figure with a battle jacket and it had all the band logos. One of the nights on that tour, I was at the merch table just looking at it and I was like, "Damn, that's sick." Later on, Tony or another one of the Waste guys was telling me about the cover artwork. They brought up your name as they were showing me it, and it put the bug in my brain because they said that you were from Vegas.
I had some ideas for "Deathwestern" that I was going back and forth with alongside our A&R guy, the legendary Mike Gitter. He had different people in mind and our management and was also going around with their ideas. It was important to me to find somebody that would just make something that incorporated all the actual elements of my band in an organic way.
I don't want to hate on other people's cover art, and I'm not, but personally, I just feel it's better when the artwork is one of one to the album rather than something that was maybe painted 20 years ago for a different purpose. I like to look at a cover that actually reflects what's in it, whether it's a book or a record or whatever. It's cool to license somebody's stuff, but it's never been my preference. It's even worse when it has nothing to fucking do with the subject it's representing. I used to fucking hate when I'd buy a book and it would have this badass cover like a demon or some cool sci-fi thing, and then you're reading the book and you're like, "Where the fuck is this nasty ass snake dude with three heads?"It was a classic Molly Hatchet example. You have Frank Frazetta's Death Dealer designs on there and everyone knows Molly Hatchet doesn't sound anything like that.
Add Nazareth to that list.
Stu: Yeah, exactly. So anyway, that's a long way of saying that's how we hooked up. Then, we ate some tacos and got on the same page. James' work isn't just a piece of repurposed art. We created our own world here. Also, since that record came out, I've had plenty of people who don't even listen to death metal or hardcore music, aren't metalheads, that came about the record and just thought it looked sick. That was their intro and now they love the tunes inside.
James: For me, that's it right there. That reaction is what you should aim for and it happens when both elements fall on the other. I love when you see an album and you just have to check it out because the cover art just speaks to you.
When Stu reached out about doing "Helldorado", it was very much a case of myself knowing there are plenty of people who really dig that "Deathwestern" cover. There's an expectation there and they want something that will live up to that. It's my first time with a band doing a second cover, though I don't believe the goal was to try and top ourselves. I think we ultimately just wanted to make something that we're really proud of and really happy with. We wanted something that reflects what we think is good artistic decision making and just feels really honest. Stu and I went into this one not trying to do "Deathwestern" again, but approach it a little differently while still feeling true to the band. For me as an artist, everything was just really satisfying.
Instead of using fully warm colors and forming the poster dynamic of it all with the composition like we did the first time around, we were going to pull from a different kind of Western iconography, which is all those classic night paintings. We were set on going for a cooler aesthetic where it's a lot more subtle, but eerie rather than big and "in your face" like old Western posters. I mean, it's still a cowboy reaper on a pale skull horse. He's got a noose on the side on his gun holsters and shit, but I feel like it's much more focused on a singular piece of more subtle iconography that plays 100% into the Spiritworld dynamic.
It's refreshing to see you two speak so enthusiastically about the collaboration and how well you work off one another's ideas. There's an authentic continuity here where nothing is forced in this living, breathing Spiritworld discography. Where would you say that you two found common ground in bringing both records to fruition?
Stu: I think it's because we're both genuine people that want to make cool shit. If I'm reaching out to people and it becomes solely about the money and about meeting a deadline, I lose interest in working with somebody. I'm very straight up and say, "Hey, here's the budget and here's my rough timeline," and I hope it's enough from the jump. You can just tell when somebody's fired up to work with you or if it's just a regular business transaction. From our conversations at the very beginning, James and I just wanted to make badass shit for my band. It's as simple as that for me and it seems like that should be commonplace, but it's really not.
I really love that I can come with these fleshed out ideas and James makes something out of it. I think I sent you some Frank Tenney Johnson Nocturne paintings for reference and just mentioned, "I think if we go this direction, but with your spin, it's going to be a home run." Fast forward to when you sent me the sketch and you fucking nailed it. You were talking about the pressure of doing the second record and I've already had so many people hit me up and be like, "Dude, how the fuck did he do another cover that is so sick? This one is even better in Deathwestern!" I would say that passion for this project is the thing that we connect with, at least me. I don't know about you, James. What do you think?
James: I agree. I mean I initially started working with you because I heard "Pagan Rhythms" (2020) and thought it rocked. Then, I discovered y'all were from Las Vegas, so when you hit me up, it was seamless. We were both interested in working with each other, so it made it that much easier given that we actually like each other's work as opposed to some publicist being like, "Hey, this person would like to work with you."
A big component of this project is that it's largely Vegas based. There's plenty of great stuff that's coming out of Vegas, but I feel that Vegas can often be overlooked in the underground music scene. It's very common for big heavy music tours to skip right over us and there's all sorts of reasons for that, so it's nice as somebody who's born and raised in Vegas to be able to contribute to something Vegas based that is getting out a cool, creative statement to the world. I love the idea of contributing to that on top of the fact that I already really liked the tunes. With Stu, I like the way he thinks about things from a conceptual angle, but also from a very "I want to make some kick ass tunes" angle. He doesn't want to be limited to what he can sound like, what he can talk about, and I just love the idea of contributing to that. If people dig it, then cool, but the goal is to please creative goals first and foremost by staying true to the project.
This is not a knock on anyone, but there's a lot of bands that have the same ideas being sent back and forth. There's a whole lot of "guy with a sword standing in front of some castle" or somebody wanting their own version of a Dan Seagrave or Ed Repka piece, which is all fine and dandy. I love doing that sort of stuff, too, and I always try to make sure it comes off as my own, but working with Spiritworld is its own thing that I don't get to do pretty often. It makes it very fun for me.
Stu: That's a great point about the Vegas stuff. I grew up here. I came up in the DIY scene, booking punk bands and hardcore bands. On "Pagan Rhythms", I did all the artwork and layout.
On "Deathwestern", it was all James artistically. then Piper Ferrari from a great band, Roman Candle, did all the layout. Our homie Kat (Mantor) from down here took a couple of pictures for the album, including one that was on the poster that was taken in the desert a couple hours north. One of the pictures was by my mom.
On this record, my homie Jasmine (Garcia), who does creative direction over at Zappos, did all the press photos. When you start digging into my band, a lot of the work that made this happen is done locally.
People talk about when you make it somewhere, you have a choice: Do you go to LA and New York to make it or do you work with the artists and the people that you came up with? If you ask me, I think we have some of the most talented people anywhere, so why not collab with the people that are from the same fucking streets that you're from? I take a lot of pride in that too. I think it's cool as shit. I think it's cool as fuck when people show up for their scene, whether it's going to shows or putting other people on by supporting new bands. That shit's important. It doesn't happen all the time, and you have bands that don't do that, so I try to do it with my band, I'm not saying that I'll never work with somebody outside of Vegas, but there's just so many cool people here. I'm proud to share it and I hope James gets a bunch of covers and merch designs from people having seen my band. It's a tangible, snowball effect. It's good for the economy baby, it keeps us all working.
James: I mean, it literally has already happened multiple times where people have sent me the "Deathwestern" cover and they're like, "Hey, we saw this and thought it was awesome. Could you do something like this for us?"
That's amazing, and the best part is that none of this transactional as spoke of. There's no, "Hey, here's x amount of dollars to make me something cool that'll look good on a Spotify playlist or whatever." There are genuine conversations being had throughout the entire process and this time around, it resulted in a more atmospheric, more somber result that is felt musically as well. The transition from "Prayer Lips" to "Waiting On The Reaper" is perfect. Going from a beautiful, melodic piece that concludes into a ripper was a welcome part of the album, and there's a lot of sonic variety wedged in between the world building of the lyricism. Where do you feel that the two elements interplay? Is it just a natural byproduct of your collaboration or was it very much intentional from the moment you first approached the album cycle?
Stu: James, I sent you demos, right? Did I have all the demos when we first started looking at the art? I think I did because it's important to me to be like, "Here's my idea of these Western Nocturne paintings and here are the demos of the record that I'm working on way before the record's done." I just remember I got some texts from you where you're like, "Damn, dude, these new songs are sick. I get what you're doing." He's pointing out the atmospherics and the more country flavor that I put into it. When people pick up on these changes and they say there's continuity like you said, I think that's cool.
James: Yeah, you sending me the demos before anything definitely helps. To any band reading who wants to work with me, please give me lyrics and demos if you got 'em. If you have lyrics and solid ideas of what you're going for, I can start brainstorming a lot easier. When I heard the earlier versions of these songs, I could tell, "Oh, okay, things are changing up a little bit." It's still Spiritworld, but you're adding different layers to things and adding depth. Not that you would want me to, but I can't just do "Deathwestern" again, it has to come from a different angle.
I did have the title logo from you early on, and that helped too because I knew with that arching shape I had something really impressive to put smack dab in the middle and the bottom. I needed to find a way to make sure that the composition worked to compliment whatever was there, especially since it's largely yellow and brown and red. I knew I couldn't just do another red cover. It's just going to blend right into it and it's not going to pop off of it, so it was all around a better decision to go with a night scene with tons more cool colors. The logo just pops right off of it.
Stu: See, this is the interesting part of a relatively new band where you don't know what you're doing in your band, right? It's all bullshit. You make it up as you go. I was designing the new suits with a friend of mine that I came up with in the metal and hardcore scene with. He's a great tattoo artist. I'm sending him demos, we're talking about what the new suits are going to look like, and he's drawing sketches. I just kept coming back to the album title, "Helldorado", and asked him to do a rope font, which I then sent to James. We had that, the demos, the influences, which included some Frederick Johnson. Essentially, we had a whole mood board and it was then up to James to do his thing. I know we were going to end up somewhere really fucking cool.
It all organically comes together and the result was a high mark, in my opinion. When you guys were approaching the creative development of it all, what did you guys set out to achieve from your respective standpoints?
James: I mean, from the art point of view, so much of this process of working with bands revolves around meeting the clients where they are creatively while in some way keeping a certain amount of yourself in there. It's not me making the music, coming up with the lyrics, concept, and everything, so I just have to find the best way of delivering that in a way that is true to the artist's voice. In short, clients come to me with a concept and everything else, and then I just have to figure out the best way to interpret it.
Specifically with "Helldorado", it was very much about evolving from "Deathwestern", which is a very bombastic, very full cover with lots of stuff going on. It very much reflects the vibe of the record, which is very big and "in your face" loud. To have this one reflect the changes that are going on and still feel true to the world that Stu created, it felt better dial it back and focus on a more controlled singular piece of iconography as opposed to the previous album that had a more classic poster approach to it. We wanted the simple lone figure in a Western background, but still with all the details that heighten it beyond just a standard cowboy painting. That was the main goal, and I think through our collaboration, we got something real special out of it that still feels new, at least to us. I think Spiritworld fans have shown that they're really digging the approach of everything. For me personally, it's one of my favorite covers that I've done. I'm happy to share the full piece with you because it has much more to show.
Stu: It's definitely a great wraparound piece. To answer your question though, for me going into projects, I just try to make cool shit that I like. It's simple. You can get into the details of stuff, but at the end of the day, I only fuck with stuff that I like. That's why I do a band. I'm one of the people that watches a film or reads a book, and if they blow the ending or whatever, I'm going to have a thousand ideas of what I would've did differently rather than just be a fucking troll. I don't really have an online presence and I definitely don't ever get on nitpicking people, so when I have those thoughts in my head of like, "Boy, you really fucked this up" or "Hey, you could have done some wildly different things," I always go to my own stuff instead and start doing things that I personally like for myself. Every project, every riff, every song, every collaboration is always something that I feel is fucking badass. Pretty simple. That's it.
I don't want to say that this is a culminating feat for you because I feel like there's still a lot more to come, but the growth since "Pagan Rhythms" has been tremendous and you continuously amplify everything. Personally, I feel that "Helldorado" is your most comprehensive work to date. Stu, as you sit back and wind down the release cycle and enter the touring cycle, what do you take from it all in reflection?
Stu: Great question. I don't really think like that. I am a maker, so for me, whether I'm sharing stuff with people or not, I am playing guitar, I'm writing songs, I have ideas, and I'm doing stuff. There's always a challenge in doing so because you learn more and then you incorporate what you learned from the last process, which isn't always easy. "Deathwestern" at the time felt like a big step forward as far as how much time I spent on the production and the artwork, and I thought things really came together in a cool way. Since it hit a certain "high" level for me, that's where you're starting from on this next album. Like you said, I don't think we're at the high mark of where it's going to go artistically. I think with the stuff I'm working on now, I have some ideas that are really going to push some boundaries. It's a journey at the end of the day.
You never get to the top. I feel like I could be doing this and making records in 20 years and still have so much to learn and so many things I want to try. It's cool to hear somebody say that they see the growth in what we're doing.
That's a good way of looking at it — a stepping stone in the right direction towards your creative fulfillment. For you, James, you've had the opportunities of working with bands across the world and all sorts of different cool projects, some that tap into your own creative interests and others that don't tap into your creative interests as much but allow for you to put your own creative lens on something that you perhaps wouldn't otherwise have done. Working with Spiritworld is an evident standout in your repertoire. What do you take from the experience of having worked together with Stu and essentially build the band's visual identity throughout these recent years?
James: It's very universal what Stu was saying about just wanting to create. My mind's always going with different ideas and stuff to take on. Sometimes, it's actually hard for me to sleep just because I want to write down different things I've got in my brain, even if I wake up the next day and those ideas aren't great. I think especially as a freelance artist, you're always kind of in the mode of being the train, but also having to put down tracks in front of you at the same time. The best I can do is try to make sure that I'm proud of the stuff that I'm making and that I hold myself up to certain standards,
Specifically with Spiritworld, I can see the front and back cover for "Deathwestern" nowadays and feel very proud of what I did, but because of the growth I've done, I immediately see things that I'd change. That's not to be overly critical of myself, but you can't help it when you're an artist. You always want to try to improve things and be able to be the best version of yourself so that you can show people what you got. With "Helldorado", it feels "right" at this very moment. This is what I can do, this is what I'm capable of. I think this really shows off my abilities in a way I'm really proud of, and it just feels like a cool image overall.
In making that cover, I wanted to make something that felt as if you could get a statue of that figure. I wanted to make a character in a sense, and also something that feels like you could see it a mile away and know what cover it is. The title of it and the title design really helps that, too. It feels so beautifully rendered and very iconic in its own way, so it fulfills everything I want. Ultimately, it's just about holding yourself up to certain standards and just making sure you keep creating and you stay happy with what you're creating instead of maybe occasionally settling too much just for the sake of steadily getting work. I'm fortunate right now to be in a place creatively where I can start to turn down projects because it's either just not for me or I don't have the time for it, or it's just something that I feel like isn't the best use of my skills. I'm hoping more and more in 2025 to really make time for the things I really want to do instead of just being agreeing to stuff out of pure fear for the work drying up, I feel like if you just keep making cool shit and people keep coming back for it, you'll be all right.
That says a lot about you and your practice, which is fantastic. If you don't like it, you don't take it and compromise your artistic integrity. You're doing things that you're genuinely invested in and actually care deeply about enough to put your own creative lens on it. It's a point in a career that a lot of artists would want to reach, for sure.
James: Absolutely, and I'm very thankful that I can do that at this point because 20 and 21 year old me me could not do that. It's because of covers like "Deathwestern" that I can now. We worked on that late 2020 and into 2021, and it didn't come out until 2022. Some of these things just take time, but now because of it, this career became full-time reality.
May it continue to flourish as much as it has. Stu, is there a sense of, I don't want to say catharsis, but relief or accomplishment with releasing "Helldorado" after all that went invested into it? You're constantly on the go, you're already working on the next album after this. You sat on "Helldorado" for some time and with release day, there's a detachment with getting it off your chest and out into the world.
Stu: Yeah, always. James brought up the perfect point with how he looks at the "Deathwestern" cover. You can't look at stuff you make and detach yourself from the process or from your engagement with it on a personal level. I rarely listen to my stuff after it comes out, but when I do, I don't hear this rad album that a fan would. I hear all these choices that I made that piss me off. That happened a lot with "Deathwestern".
To answer your question though, there's a sense of relief that "Helldorado" is coming out, but then there's also the other side of it where it's like, "I'm done and I've been done with it so let's keep it going." Once the artwork's done, the music videos are really the last piece of the puzzle. We design the suits, get the record done, get the artwork, and once all that stuff's done, I'm already thinking of the next album with the way my brain works. I'm over it, you know? I'm not trying to fast forward through the release and doing the press and stuff, but I'm way more excited about the next project that I'm working on and the ability to translate songs live as a new adventure. It's nice to hear what people have to say, but being honest, it's not why I do it. I don't expect anybody to listen to "Helldorado" and pick up all the influences or really understand what I put into it. The people I work with closely, they can pick up something, sure, but I don't expect the general public to do so. I'm not going to do an interview where somebody's going to talk to me on a granular level about this piece of work and really get it. I don't think anybody absorbs stuff to that level unless you're one of those folks that really deep dive into every aspect of your work.
I don't know, I'm relieved, but I'm also chomping at the bit to have space to work on new stuff. I have the opportunity to make really cool stuff and have people give a fuck. That's the battle right there because I still have a day job and shit, but that's more of my lifestyle, which is set up in a way where I don't want to be a starving artist. Spiritworld would have to get so much bigger to replace my income. When I see bands that are out living that life, I'm jealous a little bit that you can just focus all your energy. At the same time, I'm really thankful to have the work-life balance I have. At times, I consider the band to be part of an outlet and a hobby and a thing that I don't have. I'm sure if James doesn't get a couple projects in within a certain timeframe, he might stress about bills and shit, you know? I'm glad that my art doesn't have anything to do with financial stability, only what I'd like to hear and see in a band.
Spiritworld is as unfiltered and true to Stu Folsom as it could possibly be. It's an extension of yourself, self-contained and honest to your creative ambitions.
Stu: It's a great spot to be at. I'm blessed to be there. There's a lot of people I know that are really great songwriters and artists and writers and painters that make cool shit, but unfortunately, if no one sees it, no one cares. It's really fucking cool to be able to share stuff and have people get excited. It's exciting to know that people see this stuff and realize all of the time and energy that went into it. I can see that it's snowballing and this record's bigger than the last one. The momentum is trucking, and that feels pretty good from a place of validation I guess, though that's not why I do it. Like I said earlier, I just make what I think is cool, and I'm lucky that it connects. I don't know how to tell somebody else to do it. It's not like we have a huge budget with a massive marketing team and other teams doing behind the scenes things like that. it's literally just word of mouth, which I'm very thankful for. In the flip of a coin, you could do this and no one could give a shit.
Helldorado is available now via Century Media (Listen).
